Homer B Week 19 The Taming of the Shrew

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Homer B Week 19 The Taming of the Shrew

Postby ccinIdaho » Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:12 pm

Hello,

For the parsing, I was wondering why "when" and "as" weren't conjunctions. They both have subjects and verbs after them, so it seems like they would need to be conjunctions to connect the subjects and verbs to the rest of the sentence. Also, I didn't understand why "that" was an expletive. I thought it was an unneeded conjunction (like the that in the first diagram).

As always, thanks!
C.C.
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Re: Homer B Week 19 The Taming of the Shrew

Postby admin » Sat Apr 20, 2013 4:35 pm

Easier question first -- 'that' in the diagram isn't an unneded conjunction, it's an expletive. It's totally unneeded by the rest of the sentence and doesn't really join anything to anything else - it's just sitting in there. I'm not sure how, historically, it got into English, but I would guess the story is interesting.

'When' and 'as' aren't conjunctions. Remember, conjunctions either join words/phrases/clauses of equal rank or joins clauses of unequal rank.You can see at a glance that a coordinating conjunction is unlikely here, so if 'when' or 'as' is a conjunction, it must be subordinate. The clauses being subordinated, though, don't make any sense without the word being considered for conjunction status. Consider 'he liked with her' -- does that make sense as a clause standing by itself? It doesn't to me, except perhaps in this day of Facebook. :roll: The same goes for 'should have been the wedding breakfast.'

Relative adverbs, like we're dealing with here, can introduce adverb clauses or adjective clauses.

Carolyn
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Re: Homer B Week 19 The Taming of the Shrew

Postby ccinIdaho » Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:08 pm

Hi Carolyn,

I understand about the word "that"; however, I'm struggling to understand the "when" and "as." "As" sort of makes sense because I see your point about "he liked with her" not making sense by itself. How would "he liked with her" be diagrammed? Is it a direct object? If the "as" doesn't connect it to "he could do," then how does it connect?

I don't understand about the "when." It seems that "the wedding breakfast should have been" does make sense. If I write the sentence in order, it seems like a subordinate clause to me: "when the wedding breakfast should have been." If "when" isn't a conjunction, then I'm again confused how this clause would be connected to "Petruchio carried his wife away."

I also noticed in the answer key for the parsed sentence that "to eat" and "(to) drink" don't have a role assigned to them. I don't understand why, but it seems like in previous situations (like the previous week) this construction was used and they would be called object complements. Is that correct?

Thanks!
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Re: Homer B Week 19 The Taming of the Shrew

Postby admin » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:49 am

English grammar. It's so not simple.

Sometimes, 'when' does function as a conjunction. "We will go to the store when your room is clean." There are two ideas here - 'your room is clean' and 'we will go to the store.' They're connected by 'when', telling us that one thing will happen once the condition given is fulfilled.

Then there are those times when it does not. "After the marriage, when should have been the wedding breakfast, Petruchio carried his wife away." If we try to make this sentence line up with the previous one, we have two clauses, "should have been the wedding breakfast" and "Petruchio carried his wife away." Now, the first clauses is a bit suspect. "Should have been the wedding breakfast" seems like it's missing something. If we put it down to archaic English and say "The wedding breakfast should have been" instead, it sounds a bit better. But the clauses don't fit together. There's no condition to fulfill (your room = clean. Wedding breakfast .... ?) We need the 'when' functioning as an adverb to tell us that the wedding breakfast should have been at a specific time ... after the marriage. Conjunctions can't function as part of the clause they are joining. Relative adverbs do. The whole clause functions to tell us when she was carried away.

So far as 'to eat and drink' goes, it reminds me of the Latin accusative + infinitive construction, which, if it has carried over to English nicely, means that 'to eat and drink' are the main verbs of a subordinate clause. I don't think they work as object complements (direct objects). Let me see what Lene thinks on this one.

'As he liked' would be diagrammed by putting 'as' on a diagonal line under the verb 'could do', running it down to a horizontal line with 'he liked' on it. It's awfully conjunction-looking, but that's the way the examples go.

Carolyn
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